BEI: Maureen “Ma Dukes” Yancey Interview

Marueen Yancey, or “Ma Dukes” as she’s affectionately entitled, is full of laughter. Despite the tragedy and challenges life tossed her way like a ninety-mile-an-hour fastball -- the death of her son, the legendary James “J Dilla” Yancey, a mind-boggling legal battle with the executors of his estate and extensive health issues -- a warming cadence and an unwavering positivity resonates in every syllable she speaks. And after each anecdote, after each heartwarming story about her son’s legacy or her triumphant struggle to launch The J Dilla Foundation (a not-for-profit organization charged with funding inner-city music programs and providing scholarships to students attending schools that have progressive music curricula) or the “advantages” of her bout with Lupus following Dilla’s passing from the exact same condition, Ma Dukes releases a gregarious laugh. It's the laugh of a matriarch that celebrates life's blessings and the spirit of a lost one. It's the laugh of a woman that has no need to look for a silver lining, because she sees no clouds. It's a laugh that is equally endearing and empowering. In this lengthy yet candid interview as part of Bodega Education Initiative on July 6th, BrooklynBodega.com spoke with Mrs. Yancey about the life of J Dilla, the battle to launch The J Dilla Foundation and J Dilla’s secret in selecting records to sample. BB: What was Dilla like as a child and where did his musical interests come from? MY: It came from just living in the house, 100 percent [laughs]. Everyone is musically inclined and seems to be gifted in some way. His dad always used jazz to put Dilla to sleep. So, you know, his first music for nursery rhymes or put to sleep music was jazz and that’s what he went to sleep by. It was the only thing that would put him to sleep, as a matter of fact. When he wasn’t well or had those baby fevers or whatever, it would be jazz that would soothe him or make him go to sleep. We really didn’t notice until he was almost a year old the profound effect that would have on him as a child, because before he was walking or standing, James Brown had really influenced him to the fact that he would jump up as if he could stand or walk and dance to the entire length of a James Brown record -- any James Brown record -- until almost the last few beats. He was aware of the record almost ending, and he would get this petrified look on his face and grab ahold of the side of the playpen and ease his way down [as if] he had remembered that he couldn’t walk or stand up yet. But he was having the time of his life until [the song ended]. [Laughs] He always loved music. He always collected records as a young child. At two years old, he’d put on his hat and sun glasses that matched and his little jacket and walk to the park and spin records. And this is what he did daily as a recreational activity for himself. He was not like my foster son who would play with trucks and cars and all of the Transformer-type toys that he had. Dilla didn’t have time for that [because] he was busy spinning records. Always. BB: If I understand correctly, you have an opera background and your husband has a jazz background... MY: Yes, that is what I was trained to do as a child. By having a music teacher in the family, I was trained for the opera and of course she used me [laughs] to do all the concerts in school and everything [laughs]. She didn’t have to worry, I just spent weekends learning pieces and before the end of the year I’d perform these pieces. That started in elementary school so by the time I was a teenager, I was in love with it. [Laughs] BB: Did either of you have any reservations with Dilla stepping into Hip-Hop and rap music, especially when it was so new? MY: Uh, no. I’ll tell you, at the time, he was well versed in all types of music. He played snare drum for a gospel group every Sunday. He would rehearse with different people and we knew this is what youth were listening to. You know, at the time when [Hip-Hop] came out, everybody [was saying that rap music] would be in and out in two years. And I can tell people now, I remind them, that ‘you always said that it would only last a year or two and it’s still here and it’s growing and it’s a culture now’. I do remember that, but we weren’t worried about it because he was a great kid and he had his head on straight so it wouldn’t have mattered. BB: The reason I ask is because I remember a lot of adults at that time had a big problem with the language... MY: Yeah, you know there were songs that had our eye brows raised but we knew that he knew where and when to use it. He had the utmost respect at home. And when he performed, he even asked that we maybe not go to St. Andrews when he performed and when people would invite us there he would say ‘No, you’re not going to appreciate the language‘. And that’s what was up and we respected that. And of course they would rehearse in the house, and we could hear it, but you know, we knew it was part of what the music brought. It was a package and we felt secure in all that he did because he wasn’t flighty, he wasn’t a follower and he had is own world revolved around his music. So we felt great about it because he was such a respectful individual. BB: You mentioned that Dilla always had a musical interest, but at what point did you realize that that interest was truly an exceptional talent? MY: I think when different artists tried to get him to come to their side. It seemed like there was a little thing going on at one time, he was getting phone calls maybe from [A Tribe Called Quest] and Babyface at the same time, trying to get him to come do something here or there or whatever. And it seemed like it was a [bidding] war kind of thing going on. And he was so involved and working with so many different people that we figured that he had something going on here and everybody wants a part. BB: How did he get involved with so many different major industry players? MY: Oh I’ll tell you, the key to it all was Amp Fiddler. Amp Fiddler opened the door and he took special time with Dilla. He was and still is huge in Detroit. It didn’t matter what type of music they were going into, he’d take the time to nurture skill if they had any or to educate them on the keys or any instrument or on his various engineering talents -- they’d master those right there at Amp Fiddler’s. BB: So Amp Fiddler was the door way... MY: He’s the key. He’s the one that introduced Dilla to Q-Tip. So that was it, then it was over. BB: What year are we talking about? 1992? MY: Amp was working with him before then, that was like in the late 80s. Dilla was already going over to Amp’s doing studio work. But by the time he had honed his skills and Amp felt that they were to perfection, he introduced him to Q-Tip. BB: When you started hearing about Q-Tip wanting to work with Dilla or Babyface wanting to work with Dilla, did you have an opinion on which direction he should go? MY: No, we never interfered because we always told our children, even as toddlers, right from wrong and we felt like we should respect their wishes. Kids don’t always feel the same way that their parents do and parents aren’t always right. You try to lead them in one direction and you hope it’s the right direction but we’re all different. So what’s right for me might not always be right for you. We always wanted to guide them in the right direction but if they felt that their direction was a little different, we respected that. BB: One of the interesting paradigms when it comes to Dilla’s career is that he’s worked with pretty much everyone [in the industry], he can pretty much do anything when it comes to creating sounds yet he’s still under acknowledged... MY: Yeah, that’s a fact [laughs]. People are still learning about him and his work is still being brought forth by a lot of individuals. And it’s still an honor. I would have loved to have it happened while he was here because he spent his entire life dedicated to it because it’s what he felt he was here for. Music was his life’s blood. But it wasn’t in vain. We’re still doing all we can, fans alike, to make sure his music was heard and that he stays out there and that people realize that he was here on a mission and he accomplished that before he left. BB: It seems to me that he was more reserved, that he didn’t want the spotlight... MY: No, he didn’t. He was bashful. It was totally different than his stage persona. Very bashful. He wasn’t at all comfortable just talking all the time because he stuttered -- as a child, oh yes, he did stutter [laughs]. So he never wanted to be caught uncomfortable and that was one reason. When he would get wrapped up in something or get excited or get into his music, he wouldn’t stutter. He could rap all day without stuttering, but that passion is what made him comfortable. He was happy in that environment and he really didn’t care about seeing or [talking about] what he did. He just wanted to do good work, make it quality work so people could enjoy it. BB: I read an interesting article where Q-Tip described having to drag Dilla to the Grammy’s one year just because he didn’t want that acknowledgement, didn’t want to be in that environment. MY: He sure didn’t. No, he did not. I got that phone call that night [laughs]. I was excited that he was there, but the phone call let me know that he was really unhappy [laughs]. BB: What did he say on the phone call? Could you hear it in his voice? MY: Oh my God, yes I could hear it in his voice because he was in tears [laughs]. He was angry. He was angry [laughs]. I was here wishing I was there with him, you know. And he was crying and said he wasn’t going in [to the Grammy Awards show]! [Laughs] BB: I feel as though the Donuts project is probably the most personal for you... MY: Yes. BB: But is there a certain time period that stands out the most that is your favorite time period for his work? MY: Donuts is incredibly new to me as far as picking me up and carrying me all day. But in the beginning with Pharcyde, that was something. And for many years my favorite has been “Vivarant Thing” [laughs]. That’s been my favorite for years. And “Breathe And Stop” -- I missed it totally while he was composing it, but I was out in the truck riding with my husband in Detroit, and I heard a couple of beats come on before any vocals, and I jumped up in the front of the truck and said ‘That’s Jay! That’s Jay’. And my husband was like ‘What?‘ And I said ‘This is Jay’s music’. I knew after the first couple of beats that was him. It just grabbed me, you know. And I called him on the phone all crazy and everything saying ‘Did you do this? Did you do this?‘ And he said ‘Didn’t you know?’ But he never discussed those things. I never knew about magazine articles, newspapers, anything that was going on until somebody else called me and told me. He never even talked about it. BB: So Pharcyde and “Breathe and Stop”... MY: Yeah, Pharcyde because that “Runnin”, it was just incredible. And to hear that music at the same time that you’re watching ski resort commercials, that was something. That was something big for us. BB: The story behind The J Dilla Foundation is talked about enough in Hip-Hop circles that all of us are enraged at the way it was managed to a degree. If I’m not mistaken, you wanted to start the Foundation in February of 2006, correct? MY: Yes, February 2006 was the first one. And then all that craziness with the old estate [happened] and, of course, we had a reprieve. We decided to try it again and, you know, I wouldn’t give up. I was just waiting to get well enough to fight. Because of the fans and because of the artists that are out there that felt the injustice, I was never really alone. Everyone was just as enraged as I was. BB: But you were able to successfully relaunch [The J Dilla Foundation] this year... MY: Oh yes, we relaunched...actually it was effective in December of 2009 and we have our 501(c)(3) Non-Profit [Organization] status. It’s just been great. It’s just been great. Everything is working like clockwork. We had our state approval in less than two weeks and the IRS approved our 501(c)(3) in less than ninety days. So that is just wonderful. We had our first official launch party, which was great in vibe, but not as financially successful as we’d like. But we still managed to get two of our programs off and running. BB: Describe your relationship with [former J Dilla estate executor] Arty Erk? MY: Oh my God, you know, I actually have no relationship with them. After [I] had gotten sick, I felt that they were being unjust with the family and really wanted me out of the way [laughs]. Even when they put that ad out in Billboard Magazine, that was it. I told Arty Erk that I felt that he was racist... BB: You’re referring to the ad that Arty Erk ran in Billboard Magazine in 2008 [ordering people to cease and desist from using Dilla’s work on future projects], correct? MY: Yes, yes. After that, which was done for no reason, I [decided] I won’t personally have any communication with him. I told [Dilla’s attorney, Micheline Levine] that he won’t have to worry about me asking him for anything because he acted like it was such a bother if I called and asked him anything. I told her that since she ‘seems to think that there isn’t anything wrong with what he’s doing and that he’s doing such a great job, then I’ll leave you alone also.‘ And that was it. People were just really upset at the way things were handled. BB: You mentioned that [Arty Erk] was possibly racist. Did I hear you correctly? MY: I felt he was racist. I told him ‘I felt like because I’m a black mother and I’m going through all these changes and I can’t even get any information and you won’t do anything to help at all‘. After all, I was an employee of Dilla’s, I worked for him, and I wasn’t given any consideration as to what was going on. I worked tirelessly and I left my family from my home to take care of him. I felt like they should’ve tried to do more even when Dilla was alive. So I had really had enough, you know. Every time I wanted to do something, they would try to block it and tell me I couldn’t do it. So, I felt that was unfair because it didn’t have anything to do with image or likeness, it was just people wanted to do things for me and they would threaten them to not do anything. I thought that was a little over the top. BB: So, there was essentially a three year battle to gain control? MY: It was like a battle. I was so sick, I said during a conference call ‘you know, I’m not going to worry about it. I’m very sick right now. I can’t walk for myself or do anything for myself, so I’m just going to let it go, step back and let them do whatever it is that they’re doing, and get myself strong enough to fight.’ And that’s what I did. BB: I attended the J Dilla tribute party, “Donuts Are Forever” [at The Bell House] in Brooklyn last February. ?uestlove was spinning. You were there. For me, that was the first J Dilla tribute that I had ever personally gone to. Just to witness the outpouring of love and appreciation first hand was amazing. Is there anything that surprises you as as you travel, work with different organizations with The J Dilla Foundation, and witness the amount of love he’s garnered all over the world? MY: I’m always surprised because it’s just getting bigger. That’s what knocks me off my feet. The fans, their love never dies. They’re staunch fans. They’re there for life. I’ve never seen anything like the fans over seas, and when I was in New York, it was just incredible. It was like a movement going on. The energy was something to really get choked up about. I’d never seen anything like it. And it’s growing like that, so I’m always surprised because the crowds get bigger, the ages are getting younger, and more people are introduced to him each year and they’re going back to get the music. It’s just a tremendous gathering of people everywhere and from different walks of life. BB: Are you, or The J Dilla Foundation in control of his finances at this point? MY: No, we’re still working things out. Believe it or not, they’re finally just getting all of the paperwork. They’re working with the IRS to finish all that stuff up, [medical bills] and anything that was left behind, they’re ironing it out. Once that’s ironed out, then my family can move ahead. BB: It’s great to see that everything is progressing, especially considering how things have been up to this point. MY: It’s not about money, or a price, or anything like that. It never was. It’s about respecting the work that he did and realizing that it’s worthy to be heard. And that was a discrepancy that we had with the old estate. They didn’t think anything about it. They couldn’t have cared less. His name needs to be [upheld] because he did great work and he did it for the people. It wasn’t about himself. Even in his hospital bed during his prayers, when he was almost out of it, he prayed and asked that he be able to finish his work to give back to the world. And I was sitting there and I’ll never forget those words because he wasn’t praying to feel better tomorrow or to ‘make me walk again‘, [he prayed to] ‘let me finish my work so I can give my gift back to the world‘ were his exact words. He meant that and it will always burn in my heart. He loved his fans that much. BB: I do want to ask about you and your current health. I know you’re in the midst of a bout with Lupus yourself. How are things? MY: I seem to be doing all right on that end. Nothing is getting worse on that end, I think. The fight with Diabetes was harder [laughs] when I first started having problems with that. I was on a lot of steroids and I had a heart attack. That was a really stressed time. The Rheumatoid Arthritis has been the thorn in the side, because you never know one day if you’ll be able to stand up or get out of bed or if I can put my own clothes on or what, you know. But state of mind has a lot to do with it and [you have to keep] pressing forward and make everything happen. Now I just have to get well and keep pushing it. I’m on some of the best medication now...so I can look forward to healthier, more energetic days. There's an advantage to nursing Dilla through his illness. It gave me an insight and so I know what I’m looking at so I’m not puzzled by certain reactions or certain things that happened because I already know what I’m working with. So that’s an advantage that I have. I think back to how it was handled with him and what to expect. It makes it a little easier. I don’t have to learn [about the illness]. BB: You remain a beacon of light even through the ordeals you’ve encountered. MY: Thank you. It’s an honor to do the work that I do. Even during a bad day, the work that I have to look forward to just makes the day brighter. It’s a good work and the foundation is created to help other people and that comes first. And I know [Dilla] would be proud because he believed in helping other people to accomplish whatever they can get in this world. By helping young people, that would help him smile even more. BB: How are Dilla’s daughters [Paige and Ja'Maya] and are they surprised about or understand the impact that their father had on the world? MY: They are always excited, and they’re getting used to it [laughs]! But I don’t think they’re going to realize the impact until they get a little bit older. They’re honored. I spend tons of time with them now. And the baby girl, Ja’Maya, is here every weekend. Nothing can stop her from coming to Grammies’. So that helps keep me enriched too because she’s the epitome of Dilla. She’s identical to Dilla in her mannerisms and her laughter is his. So that helps a lot too. BB: I also read how Dilla showed you how to select records in a record store... MY: Yeah [Laughs]! BB: What’s Dilla’s secret to selecting records to sample? MY: I always assumed that I’d be looking for known artists, certain songs, always looking for hit [records]. And I had it all backwards [laughs]! The key was to look for different instruments and how many guitars were on there and how many horns were on a song if it was an unknown artist. And to try to find an album with songs that had not been heard that would’ve had different instruments. So that is the key -- finding stuff that people haven’t heard that had instrumentation and could be moved around and could be composed. BB: Lastly, I do want to say congratulations. I know Berkley College [in MA] now has a J Dilla program for students, and one of the missions of The J Dilla Foundation is to support inner city youth, music programs and also bring that curriculum to institutions of higher learning. We appreciate and value the work of your organization. MY: Thank you. In 2011 it’s New York’s turn. We’ll be raising funds for New York next year. We already have it mapped out. We have so many people that we love so much in New York that we’re really going to do it up [laughs]! Maureen "Ma Dukes" Yancey and Q-Tip will speak during the Bodega Education Initiative on July 6th as part of the 2010 Brooklyn Hip-Hop Festival Week. PURCHASE TICKETS TO THE BEI HERE PURCHASE MUSIC BY J DILLA HERE For more information on The 6th Annual Brooklyn Hip-Hop Festival visit www.bkhiphopfestival.com For inquiries about The J Dilla Foundation, please visit www.jdillafoundation.org or contact by phone or email: 313.355.8488 info@jdillafoundation.org If you would like to make a donation, make your tax-deductible check payable to: THE J DILLA FOUNDATION Send to: 18456 Wexford St., Detroit, MI 48234